Phaedrus — Plato

p. 89in their arts? And you would certainly have a difficulty, Socrates, in finding a teacher of them ; but there would be no difficulty in finding a teacher of those who are wholly ignorant. And this is true of virtue or of anything ; and if a man is better able than we are to promote virtue ever so little, that is as much as we can expect.

A teacher of this sort I believe myself to be, and above all other men to have the knowledge which makes a man noble and good ; and I give my pupils their money's-worth, and even more, as they themselves confess.

And therefore I have introduced the following mode of payment : When a man has been my pupil, if he likes he pays my price, but there is no compulsion ; and if he does not Hke, he has only to go into a temple and take an oath of the value of the instructions, and he pays no more than he declares to be their value.

Such is my apologue, Socrates, and such is the argument by which I endeavor to show that virtue may be taught, and that this is the opinion of the Athenians.

And I have also attempted to show that you are not to wonder at good fathers having bad sons, or at good sons having bad fathers, as may be seen in the sons of Polycleitus, who are of the same age as our friends Paralus and Xanthippus, and who are very inferior to their father ; and this is true of many other artists. But I ought not to say the same as yet of Paralus and Xanthippus themselves, for they are young and there is still hope of them.

Protagoras ended, and in my ear — '* So charming left his voice, that I the while Thought him still speaking ; still stood fixed to hear. At length when I saw that he had really finished, I gradually recovered consciousness, and looking at Hippocrates, I said to him : O son of Apollodorus, how deeply grateful I am to you for having brought me hither ; I would not have missed the speech of Protagoras for a great deal.

For I used to imagine that no human care could make men good ; but I know better now. Yet I have still one very small difficulty which I am sure that Protagoras will easily explain, as he has already explained so much. For if a man were to go and consult 329- Pericles or any of our great speakers about these matters, ^ he might perhaps hear as fine a discourse ; but then if any one has a question to ask of any of them, like books, they can 2p. 88virtue of one another, and this is the reason why every one is ready to teach justice and the laws ; suppose, I say, that there were the same readiness and Hberality among us in teaching one another flute-playing, do you imagine, Socrates, that the sons of good flute-players would be more likely to be good than the sons of bad ones? I think not.

Would not their sons grow up to be distinguished or undistinguished according to their own natural capacities as flute-players, and the son of a good player would often turn out to be a bad one, and the son of a bad player to be a good one, and all flute-players would be good enough in comparison of those who were ignorant and unacquainted with the art of flute-playing?

In like manner I would have you consider that he who appears to you to be the worst of those who have been brought up in laws and humanities, would appear to be a just man and a master of justice if he were to be compared with men who had no education, or courts of justice, or laws, or any restraints upon them which compelled them to practice virtue — with the savages, for example, whom the poet Pherecrates ^^ exhibited on the stage at the last year's Lenaean festival.^^ If you w^ere living among men such as the man-haters in his Chorus,*'' you would be only too glad to meet with Eurybates and Phrynondas,''^ and you would sorrowfully desire the rascality of this part of the world.

And you, Socrates, are discontented, and why ? Because all men are teachers of virtue, each one according to his ability, and you say that there is no teacher. You might as well ask. Who teaches Greek? For of that too there will not be any teachers found. Or you might ask, Who is to teach the sons of our artisans this same art which they have learned of their fathers ?

He and his fellow-workmen have taught them to the best of their ability, — but who will carry them further *» Pherecrates (fe-r€k'ra-tez, 5th century B.C.): an Athenian writer of comedy. *« The Lenaea (le-ne'a) or Feast of Vats, was one of a series of religious festivals celebrated in Athens in honor of Dionysus, god of wine.

After a public banquet the citizens went to the theatre, where tragedies and comedies were presented. <7 The chorus was originally a number of persons who sang and danced at religious festivals. The drama was developed out of the chorus of the festivals in honor of Dionysus.

Even after actors were introduced the chorus was retained as an important element of the drama, though its place became gradually limited and subordinate. *» Eurybates (u-ryb'a-tez) and Phrynondas (frf-n6n'das) : "Notorious villains." — ^Jowett 3p. 89in their arts? And you would certainly have a dififc;tjHy, Socrates, in finding a teacher of them ; ]mt iliere wo<iW \je uo difficulty in finding a teacher of those who are wholly igixirant.

And this is true of virtue or of anything ; and if a tnan j» Ixrtter able than we are to promote virtue e^er w littk, tlial j» ant much as we can exp>ect- A teacher of thi« M-^rt I Mieve tnyself to be, and above all other men to have tl>e knowMp^t which makes a man noble and good ; and I give my |^u|^ik their money Vworth, and ei'en more, at) they tlierribelv^s */^nfess.

And therefore I have introd^tjmd tlte foUowiug intj4*: *A pajment : When a man has been my pupil, if he like* iie pays my price, but there is no comptjlbion ; ax A if lie ^<a% not like, he has only to go into a temple and take aii ^/ath ^/f the ^'alue of the instructions, and he j/ays no luore tiiau lie declares to be their value.

Such is my apologue, SocTates, and such is the arguiii<uit by which I endeavor to show that virtue may be taught, ai*d that this is the opinion of the Atheiiians- Aud J iiav4: aiJ>v a*, tempted to show tnat you are noi to woi#<i<;r at >^VX; V^u^At having- bad sons, or a: good ss^^iik iiaviji|/ ljii*rj UUtt^t:.. ;t^.ii^y m: Been in the sous of Poiycieiius, wi«<' ai<: </f tM: ^mij^; ^^^4- a!fc</<*/ iriendt Paraiui anci Xantiiippur.. inuc ^\^j ;tu*: **?r* titUu'/M V/ their fatiier : and tiiih ls ifu*: of >i*Wii 'At^sf a/C*^. >J*i» / outih: no: ic= i>a\ tii*: baii*i a. >e' '/ i^^iu^, ajx: /^^uUit^i^ them^eiv^. jvj- turry ap- you/j xti^*, Im;s<' #., irtil, #y>j^; i/f ^m;m«, Iroiag^jra.- •riio^. ainc. ti mi-i «;^ • y?« Ciiurttiiii|' »»r» lie >tyivi t^i^ ^ #^^ wfitlt* A: ieiir:: v:en . -iii'v ttuir '.le lad reaJly f^j -if/jC, J >(fa^«4aj»y' r»r--:»v*rtri :::riri'j:rjtsr.ess. iml jcc«±:£ at H.vx-^.faU»,.

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