Fetching
One moment.
Fetching
One moment.
Romanised transliteration as printed by the translator, not the original script. This is what we hold.
1But Il, 1, 1 INDIVIDUALITY. 4I Then Milinda called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness: ‘This Nagasena says there is no permanent individuality (no soul) implied in his name. Is it now even possible to approve him in that?’ And turning to Nagasena, he said: ‘If, most reverend Nagasena, there be no permanent individuality (no soul) involved in the matter, who is it, pray, who gives to you members of the Order your robes and food and lodging and necessaries for the sick? Who is it who enjoys such things when given? Who is it who lives a life of righteousness ? Who is it who devotes himself to meditation ? Who is it who attains to the goal of the Excellent Way, to the Nirvaza of Arahatship ? And who is it who destroys living creatures? who is it who takes what is not his own? who is it who lives an evil life of worldly lusts, who speaks lies, who drinks strong drink, who (in a word) commits any one of the five sins which work out their bitter fruit even in this life’? If that be so there is neither merit nor demerit; there is neither doer nor causer of good or evil deeds?; there is neither fruit nor result of good or evil Karma?. [26]—If, most reverend Nagasena, we are to think that were a man I doubt whether, even in our author’s time, the conception ‘subject’ was common ground, or that the word puggala had acquired that special connotation. ? Pa#kdnantariya-kammam karoti. See my note on Xullavagga VII, 3, 9 (‘ Vinaya Texts,’ vol. iii, p. 246, in the Sacred Books of the East). ? This is no doubt said in these words with allusion to the opinion ascribed in the Sama#fa Phala (D. II, 17) to Pfrana Kassapa. 5 This is the opinion ascribed in identical words in the Sama#ita Phala (D. II, 23) to Agita of the garment of hair. 42 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. II, 1, 1. to kill you there would be no murder ', then it follows that there are no real masters or teachers in your Order, and that your ordinations are void.—You tell me that your brethren in the Order are in the habit of addressing you as N4gasena. Now what is that Nagasena? Do you mean to say that the hair is Nagasena ?’ ‘I don’t say that, great king.’ ‘Or the hairs on the body, perhaps ?’ ‘Certainly not.’ ‘Or is it the nails, the teeth, the skin, the flesh, the nerves, the bones, the marrow, the kidneys, the heart, the liver, the abdomen, the spleen, the lungs, the larger intestines, the lower intestines, the stomach, the faeces, the bile, the phlegm, the pus, the blood, the sweat, the fat, the tears, the serum, the saliva, the mucus, the oil that lubricates the joints, the urine, or the brain, or any or all of these, that is Nagasena? ?’ And to each of these he answered no. ‘Is it the outward form then (Rapa) that is NAgasena, or the sensations (Vedan4), or the ideas (Sazi#a), or the confections (the constituent elements of character, Samkh4r4), or the consciousness (Vi#wana), that is Nagasena® ?’ And to each of these also he answered no.
2‘Is it the outward form then (Rapa) that is NAgasena, or the sensations (Vedan4), or the ideas (Sazi#a), or the confections (the constituent elements of character, Samkh4r4), or the consciousness (Vi#wana), that is Nagasena® ?’ And to each of these also he answered no. 1 This is practically the same opinion as is ascribed in the Samaéif#a Phala (D. II, 26) to Pakudha Kafsayana. ? This list of the thirty-two forms (444ras) of organic matter in the human body occurs already in the Khuddaka PAéfa, § 3. It is the standard list always used in similar connections; and is, no doubt, supposed to be exhaustive. There are sixteen (half as many) 4/4ras of the mind according to Dipavamsa I, 42. 5 These are the five Skandhas, which include in them the whole bodily and mental constituents of any being. See p. 80. II, 1,1. SIMILE OF THE CHARIOT. 43 ‘Then is it all these Skandhas combined that are Nagasena ?’ ‘No! great king.’ ‘But is there anything outside the five Skandhas that is NAgasena ?’ And still he answered no. ‘Then thus, ask as I may, I can discover no Nagasena. Nagasena is a mere empty sound. Who then is the Nagasena that we see before us? It is a falsehood that your reverence has spoken, an untruth !’ - And the venerable Nagasena said to Milinda the king: ‘You, Sire, have been brought up in great luxury, as beseems your noble birth. If you were to walk this dry weather on the hot and sandy ground, trampling under foot the gritty, gravelly grains of the hard sand, your feet would hurt you. And as your body would be in pain, your mind would be disturbed, and you would experience a sense of bodily suffering. How then did you come, on foot, or in a chariot ?’ ‘I did not come, Sir, on foot [27]. I came in a carriage.’ ‘Then if you came, Sire, in a carriage, explain to me what that is. Is it the pole that is the chariot ?’ ‘I did not say that.’ ‘Is it the axle that is the chariot ?’ ‘Certainly not.’ ‘Is it the wheels, or the framework, or the ropes, or the yoke, or the spokes of the wheels, or the goad, that are the chariot ?’ And to all these he still answered no. ‘Then is it all these parts of it that are the chariot ?’ 44 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. II, 1, 1. ‘No, Sir.’ ‘But is there anything outside them that is the chariot ?’ And still he answered no. ‘Then thus, ask as I may, I can discover no chariot. Chariot is a mere empty sound. What then is the chariot you say you came in? It is a falsehood that your Majesty has spoken, an untruth! There is no such thing as a chariot! You are king over all India, a mighty monarch. Of whom then are you afraid that you speak untruth? And he called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness, saying: ‘ Milinda the king here has said that he came by carriage. But when asked in that case to explain what the carriage was, he is unable to establish what he averred. Is it, forsooth, possible to approve him in that ?’
3And he called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness, saying: ‘ Milinda the king here has said that he came by carriage. But when asked in that case to explain what the carriage was, he is unable to establish what he averred. Is it, forsooth, possible to approve him in that ?’ When he had thus spoken the five hundred Yonakas shouted their applause, and said to the king: ‘ Now let your Majesty get out of that if you can ?’ And Milinda the king replied to Nagasena, and said: ‘I have spoken no untruth, reverend Sir. It is on account of its having all these things—the pole, and the axle, the wheels, and the framework, the ropes, the yoke, the spokes, and the goad—that it comes under the generally understood term, the designation in common use, of “ chariot.”’ ‘Very good! Your Majesty has rightly grasped the meaning of “chariot.” And just even so it is on account of all those things you questioned me about —(28] the thirty-two kinds of organic matter in a human body, and the five constituent elements of being—that I come under the generally understood term, the designation in common use, of ‘‘ Nagasena.” Il, 1, 2. . SENIORITY. 45 For it was said, Sire, by our Sister Vagira in the presence of the Blessed One: ‘“Just as it is by the condition precedent of the co-existence of its various parts that the word ‘chariot’ is used, just so is it that when the Skandhas are there we talk of a ‘being?’”’ ‘Most wonderful, Nagasena, and most strange. Well has the puzzle put to you, most difficult though it was, been solved. Were the Buddha himself here he would approve your answer. Well done, well done, Nagasena!’ 2. ‘How many years seniority have you, Nagasena ?’ ‘Seven, your Majesty.’ ‘But how can you say it is your “seven?” Is it you who are “seven,” or the number that is “seven?”’ Now that moment the figure of the king, decked in all the finery of his royal ornaments, cast its shadow on the ground, and was reflected in a vessel of water. And Nagasena asked him: ‘ Your figure, O king, is now shadowed upon the ground, and reflected in the water, how now, are you the king, or is the reflection the king ?’ ‘TI am the king, Nagasena, but the shadow comes into existence because of me.’ ‘Just even so, O king, the number of the years is seven, I am not seven. But it is because of me, O king, that the number seven has come into existence; and it is mine in the same sense as the shadow is yours®.’ 1 From the Samyutta Nikdya V, 10, 6. * Hardy (p. 427, § 4 of the first edition) has quite missed the point of this crux. 46 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. _ II, 1,3 ‘Most wonderful again, and strange, NAgasena. Well has the question put to you, most difficult though it was, been solved!’ 3. The king said: ‘ Reverend Sir, will you discuss with me again ?’ ‘If your Majesty will discuss as a scholar (pazdit), well; but if you will discuss as a king, no.’ ‘ How is it then that scholars discuss ?’
The source text as printed, transcribed diplomatically. Where the source language uses a non-Latin script that reaches us only through a Victorian romanisation, this layer is labelled transliteration, because that is what we hold.
Romanised transliteration as printed by the translator, not the original script. This is what we hold.
1But Il, 1, 1 INDIVIDUALITY. 4I Then Milinda called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness: ‘This Nagasena says there is no permanent individuality (no soul) implied in his name. Is it now even possible to approve him in that?’ And turning to Nagasena, he said: ‘If, most reverend Nagasena, there be no permanent individuality (no soul) involved in the matter, who is it, pray, who gives to you members of the Order your robes and food and lodging and necessaries for the sick? Who is it who enjoys such things when given? Who is it who lives a life of righteousness ? Who is it who devotes himself to meditation ? Who is it who attains to the goal of the Excellent Way, to the Nirvaza of Arahatship ? And who is it who destroys living creatures? who is it who takes what is not his own? who is it who lives an evil life of worldly lusts, who speaks lies, who drinks strong drink, who (in a word) commits any one of the five sins which work out their bitter fruit even in this life’? If that be so there is neither merit nor demerit; there is neither doer nor causer of good or evil deeds?; there is neither fruit nor result of good or evil Karma?. [26]—If, most reverend Nagasena, we are to think that were a man I doubt whether, even in our author’s time, the conception ‘subject’ was common ground, or that the word puggala had acquired that special connotation. ? Pa#kdnantariya-kammam karoti. See my note on Xullavagga VII, 3, 9 (‘ Vinaya Texts,’ vol. iii, p. 246, in the Sacred Books of the East). ? This is no doubt said in these words with allusion to the opinion ascribed in the Sama#fa Phala (D. II, 17) to Pfrana Kassapa. 5 This is the opinion ascribed in identical words in the Sama#ita Phala (D. II, 23) to Agita of the garment of hair. 42 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. II, 1, 1. to kill you there would be no murder ', then it follows that there are no real masters or teachers in your Order, and that your ordinations are void.—You tell me that your brethren in the Order are in the habit of addressing you as N4gasena. Now what is that Nagasena? Do you mean to say that the hair is Nagasena ?’ ‘I don’t say that, great king.’ ‘Or the hairs on the body, perhaps ?’ ‘Certainly not.’ ‘Or is it the nails, the teeth, the skin, the flesh, the nerves, the bones, the marrow, the kidneys, the heart, the liver, the abdomen, the spleen, the lungs, the larger intestines, the lower intestines, the stomach, the faeces, the bile, the phlegm, the pus, the blood, the sweat, the fat, the tears, the serum, the saliva, the mucus, the oil that lubricates the joints, the urine, or the brain, or any or all of these, that is Nagasena? ?’ And to each of these he answered no. ‘Is it the outward form then (Rapa) that is NAgasena, or the sensations (Vedan4), or the ideas (Sazi#a), or the confections (the constituent elements of character, Samkh4r4), or the consciousness (Vi#wana), that is Nagasena® ?’ And to each of these also he answered no.
2‘Is it the outward form then (Rapa) that is NAgasena, or the sensations (Vedan4), or the ideas (Sazi#a), or the confections (the constituent elements of character, Samkh4r4), or the consciousness (Vi#wana), that is Nagasena® ?’ And to each of these also he answered no. 1 This is practically the same opinion as is ascribed in the Samaéif#a Phala (D. II, 26) to Pakudha Kafsayana. ? This list of the thirty-two forms (444ras) of organic matter in the human body occurs already in the Khuddaka PAéfa, § 3. It is the standard list always used in similar connections; and is, no doubt, supposed to be exhaustive. There are sixteen (half as many) 4/4ras of the mind according to Dipavamsa I, 42. 5 These are the five Skandhas, which include in them the whole bodily and mental constituents of any being. See p. 80. II, 1,1. SIMILE OF THE CHARIOT. 43 ‘Then is it all these Skandhas combined that are Nagasena ?’ ‘No! great king.’ ‘But is there anything outside the five Skandhas that is NAgasena ?’ And still he answered no. ‘Then thus, ask as I may, I can discover no Nagasena. Nagasena is a mere empty sound. Who then is the Nagasena that we see before us? It is a falsehood that your reverence has spoken, an untruth !’ - And the venerable Nagasena said to Milinda the king: ‘You, Sire, have been brought up in great luxury, as beseems your noble birth. If you were to walk this dry weather on the hot and sandy ground, trampling under foot the gritty, gravelly grains of the hard sand, your feet would hurt you. And as your body would be in pain, your mind would be disturbed, and you would experience a sense of bodily suffering. How then did you come, on foot, or in a chariot ?’ ‘I did not come, Sir, on foot [27]. I came in a carriage.’ ‘Then if you came, Sire, in a carriage, explain to me what that is. Is it the pole that is the chariot ?’ ‘I did not say that.’ ‘Is it the axle that is the chariot ?’ ‘Certainly not.’ ‘Is it the wheels, or the framework, or the ropes, or the yoke, or the spokes of the wheels, or the goad, that are the chariot ?’ And to all these he still answered no. ‘Then is it all these parts of it that are the chariot ?’ 44 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. II, 1, 1. ‘No, Sir.’ ‘But is there anything outside them that is the chariot ?’ And still he answered no. ‘Then thus, ask as I may, I can discover no chariot. Chariot is a mere empty sound. What then is the chariot you say you came in? It is a falsehood that your Majesty has spoken, an untruth! There is no such thing as a chariot! You are king over all India, a mighty monarch. Of whom then are you afraid that you speak untruth? And he called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness, saying: ‘ Milinda the king here has said that he came by carriage. But when asked in that case to explain what the carriage was, he is unable to establish what he averred. Is it, forsooth, possible to approve him in that ?’
3And he called upon the Yonakas and the brethren to witness, saying: ‘ Milinda the king here has said that he came by carriage. But when asked in that case to explain what the carriage was, he is unable to establish what he averred. Is it, forsooth, possible to approve him in that ?’ When he had thus spoken the five hundred Yonakas shouted their applause, and said to the king: ‘ Now let your Majesty get out of that if you can ?’ And Milinda the king replied to Nagasena, and said: ‘I have spoken no untruth, reverend Sir. It is on account of its having all these things—the pole, and the axle, the wheels, and the framework, the ropes, the yoke, the spokes, and the goad—that it comes under the generally understood term, the designation in common use, of “ chariot.”’ ‘Very good! Your Majesty has rightly grasped the meaning of “chariot.” And just even so it is on account of all those things you questioned me about —(28] the thirty-two kinds of organic matter in a human body, and the five constituent elements of being—that I come under the generally understood term, the designation in common use, of ‘‘ Nagasena.” Il, 1, 2. . SENIORITY. 45 For it was said, Sire, by our Sister Vagira in the presence of the Blessed One: ‘“Just as it is by the condition precedent of the co-existence of its various parts that the word ‘chariot’ is used, just so is it that when the Skandhas are there we talk of a ‘being?’”’ ‘Most wonderful, Nagasena, and most strange. Well has the puzzle put to you, most difficult though it was, been solved. Were the Buddha himself here he would approve your answer. Well done, well done, Nagasena!’ 2. ‘How many years seniority have you, Nagasena ?’ ‘Seven, your Majesty.’ ‘But how can you say it is your “seven?” Is it you who are “seven,” or the number that is “seven?”’ Now that moment the figure of the king, decked in all the finery of his royal ornaments, cast its shadow on the ground, and was reflected in a vessel of water. And Nagasena asked him: ‘ Your figure, O king, is now shadowed upon the ground, and reflected in the water, how now, are you the king, or is the reflection the king ?’ ‘TI am the king, Nagasena, but the shadow comes into existence because of me.’ ‘Just even so, O king, the number of the years is seven, I am not seven. But it is because of me, O king, that the number seven has come into existence; and it is mine in the same sense as the shadow is yours®.’ 1 From the Samyutta Nikdya V, 10, 6. * Hardy (p. 427, § 4 of the first edition) has quite missed the point of this crux. 46 THE QUESTIONS OF KING MILINDA. _ II, 1,3 ‘Most wonderful again, and strange, NAgasena. Well has the question put to you, most difficult though it was, been solved!’ 3. The king said: ‘ Reverend Sir, will you discuss with me again ?’ ‘If your Majesty will discuss as a scholar (pazdit), well; but if you will discuss as a king, no.’ ‘ How is it then that scholars discuss ?’
The source text as printed, transcribed diplomatically. Where the source language uses a non-Latin script that reaches us only through a Victorian romanisation, this layer is labelled transliteration, because that is what we hold.
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